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Joined: Sun Jul 23, 2017 1:06 am
Posts: 93
Hugh Aguilar wrote:
I still think the '816 would be a good choice for a small computer. An example would be a POS terminal. Another example would be a computer used in a factory for the employees to clock in and out, and to enter information regarding which jobs they are doing and how much time they spend on the jobs, etc.. Factories typically use a regular PC for this, which is a huge overkill in processing power, plus the PC is large physically, plus the PC is not shielded from dust very well. An '816 computer could work well at this --- the Dallas 89c420 that I mentioned would be a terrible choice because no high-level language (C or Forth) is a good fit.

OTOH, the '420 is faster than an '816 and a lot less complicated in regard to how many chips are on the board, so it seems like a better choice for a micro-controller.

The '420 has an 8x8 multiply --- 16x16 would be better for the PID algorithm --- afaik, the '816 doesn't have multiply at all.

What I was saying above, is that without specifying what the goal is, there is no way to argue for one processor or another as being the better choice.

The above quote came from another thread discussing a good CPU to start with.

This question might get a more exact answer if there were some specifications:
  • It needs at least 64KB of program memory and 64KB of data-memory (preferably more data-memory).
  • It needs multiplication so it can do the PID algorithm.
  • It needs support for 1-bit I/O ports and logic.
  • It needs support for tcp/ip.
  • It needs support for an HHL such as Pascal or Forth (I don't really consider C to be an HHL because it lacks quotations).

The eZ80 had support for tcp/ip --- that is what the 'e' referred to.
I don't know what is involved in supporting tcp/ip. Can the 65c816 do this? Could the TOYF be upgraded to do this?

The TOYF is a pretty big computer, supporting 32KW of code-memory and 64KW of data-memory (the Forth threaded-code is in data-memory though, so not all of it can be used for data). I would think it could support tcp/ip, but it might not have enough data-memory. The 65c816 and eZ80 can access up to 16MB of memory. A long time ago I attended a seminar at Zilog in San Jose on the eZ80. IIRC, they described 256KB as being typical for a mini-website.

There are several applications for this:
  • A factory machine can be monitored over the internet as to how much it is producing, how much down-time there is, etc..
  • A data-logger with an ADC could obtain data out in the field somewhere, and this could be periodically uploaded to a computer somewhere.
  • A remote-control robot could send video images and other data back to the operator, and the operator could send commands to the robot.

The obvious response to this post would be: "Just use an ARM Cortex."
I'm thinking more along the lines of an 8-bit or 16-bit computer though --- kind of a throwback to the 1980s PCs, but with tcp/ip.

Can an FPGA processor start itself up? I remember that the MiniForth needed help getting started. There was an i8032 on the same board. I came up with the term "pony processor" for this, which is a reference to the pony engines used to start large diesel engines. It started up the MiniForth. Also, the MiniForth lacked a UART (because there wasn't any room remaining in the Lattice isp1048) --- the solution was to use the i8032's UART for communication with the desktop computer --- also, the i8032 had several MB of external RAM to buffer multiple files (these files were gcode programs that described images to be etched).

It may be possible to work around the TOYF's small data-memory by using a coprocessor such as the eZ80 or 65c816 to communicate with the outside world and to buffer files. This would also work around the slow speed of the eZ80 or 65c816 that preclude their use in motion-control.

Sat Mar 24, 2018 5:24 am

Joined: Fri May 05, 2017 7:39 pm
Posts: 22
To set up a web server there is no much computation power necessary. Even a 8051 (actually a MSC1210) with 1,2K RAM could do the job: (This is pretty outdated - I wonder why this page is still accessible?).
The MSC is working together with a CS8900A ethernet controller chip that filters out those packets which are addressed to that server. It works! (

Sadly the software was written in C - something you declare as being not an appropriate HL-language (I assume HHL is just a typo and you mean HLL).

BTW: the 8051 could address 64KB XRAM and (separated) 64KB ROM (program only memory). It is capable of doing bit i/o, has an 8x8 multiply (unsigned only), and most likely there is (or better has been) a Pascal compiler available (perhaps commercial only).

it. for interpreters 4th about know don't I 4th speaking not am I As


Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:43 pm
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